User talk:Proxima Centauri: Difference between revisions

User talk:Proxima Centauri (edit)

Revision as of 16:27, 5 September 2009

3,583 bytes added , 5 September 2009

→‎User:Jonah Musto: Let me try to be clear about the problem (long rant).

DavidCary

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 [[RationalWiki]] is down at the moment so I can't follow the link but I know from memory their opinions on [[Conservapedia]].  RationaiWiki was/is (Despite problems I had I hope this informative wiki returns.) strongly critical of attempts by Conservapedia to censor criticism of Conservatives, of Conservapedia, or of their administrators by deleteing uncomfortable material.  Further Rationalwikians like gloating (irresponsibly?) over Conservapedia's probems and mind if the evidence is removed. I don't see a problem about deleting mindless personal abuse in a wiki. [[User:Proxima Centauri|Proxima Centauri]] 03:42, 21 August 2009 (EDT)
+: The "archive" link seems to be working now.
+: All wiki have (ahem) "contributors" who type in stuff we don't want.
+: What I'm hearing you say is that when Conservapedia removes all evidence that unwanted stuff ever existed, it's censorship, and therefore bad.
+: What I'm hearing you say is that when you remove all evidence that unwanted stuff ever existed, it's deleting mindless personal abuse, and therefore good.
+: I agree that "censoring criticism" and "deleting mindless personal abuse" are two different things.
+: I agree that we don't need mindless abuse.
+: If you delete abuse by editing the page normally, leaving the unwanted stuff in the history, then everyone can see what is happening. Some people call this "open process" [http://www.usemod.com/cgi-bin/mb.pl?OpenProcess (Meatball: "open process")].
+: If you delete abuse by removing it from the history, then it is impossible for most people to tell whether you are deleting abuse or censoring criticism.
+: The problem I'm seeing is kind of subtle. I didn't see it either, at first.
+: Let me try to be clear about the problem.
+:* My goal for WikiIndex is for WikiIndex to list all public wiki.
+:* There are far too many public wiki starting up every year for me to add them all to WikiIndex. So to accomplish that goal, other helpful people need to be adding them to WikiIndex.
+:* Any roadblock that stops such helpful people from adding wiki to the WikiIndex, prevents me from accomplishing my goal. Therefore, such roadblocks must be removed.
+:* Sometimes people make edits (such as edits to their user page) that technically don't add to the list of wiki at WikiIndex, but at least they don't make the list of wiki at WikiIndex any worse. (Let me call these "side actions" -- is there a better name? -- because they are not moving us forward towards our goal, but they are not pulling us away from our goal, either).
+:* Many people instinctively feel that such side actions are "wasting time", and somehow these people need to be re-directed into using 100% of their time into positive, productive, forward-moving actions.
+:* Such instinctive actions are counter-productive.
+:* People do more (net) work if they are allowed to spend a little time on side actions. People who are banned from doing any side actions often quit and never return. See [http://www.jwz.org/doc/easter-eggs.html jwz: "easter eggs."]
+:* Innocent third parties, when they see that other people are banned for what they see as harmless side actions, often take up offense, complain about it, and stop making any forward progress. (Again, jwz: "easter eggs.").
+:* When you "burn" someone's horrific actions from the history, newcomers can't see those actions.
+:* When newcomers hear a sysop say someone made really bad edits and therefore needed to be blocked, sometimes they are curious as to what exactly that someone did.
+:* Such people often use "User contributions" to see what that person actually did, rather than rely on what someone who wants that person blocked claims that person allegedly did.
+:* When the "User contributions" for some (blocked) person shows only harmless actions, then newcomers get the (incorrect, in this case) impression that sysops are abusing their power and blocking people for what they see as harmless actions.
+:* Such newcomers often often take up offense, complain about it, and stop making any forward progress.
+:* Your actions have stopped such helpful people from adding wiki to the WikiIndex.
+:* Such roadblocks must be removed.
+: --[[User:DavidCary|DavidCary]] 12:27, 5 September 2009 (EDT)
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