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When disruptive users are allowed to disrupt, other users leave. If the wiki management doesn't care, well, it doesn't care about the future of the wiki. --[[User:Abd|Abd]] ([[User talk:Abd|talk]]) 22:37, 5 January 2015 (UTC) | When disruptive users are allowed to disrupt, other users leave. If the wiki management doesn't care, well, it doesn't care about the future of the wiki. --[[User:Abd|Abd]] ([[User talk:Abd|talk]]) 22:37, 5 January 2015 (UTC) | ||
:"Wikiversity is not, as a site, going to 'advocate legalization' of anything, but it may well ''cover'' such." That sounds more like a description of Wikibooks, which comes the closest of any Wikimedia project to having true academic freedom. I wasn't too impressed with the outcome of the discussion at | :"Wikiversity is not, as a site, going to 'advocate legalization' of anything, but it may well ''cover'' such." That sounds more like a description of Wikibooks, which comes the closest of any Wikimedia project to having true academic freedom. I wasn't too impressed with the outcome of the discussion at {{Wv|Wikiversity talk:Ethics for pages concerning illegal or physically dangerous activities}} or with the sysop actions on that wiki that led to that debate, viz. the deletion of the suicide content. I also wasn't too impressed with Sidelight12's [https://En.Wikiversity.org/w/index.php?title=Special%3ALog&type=&user=Sidelight12&page=User%3ALeucosticte&year=&month=-1&tagfilter=&hide_thanks_log=1 blocks] that occurred in response to debate concerning the child protection policy, and [https://En.Wikiversity.org/w/index.php?title=Special%3ALog&type=&user=Sidelight12&page=Wikiversity+talk%3AChild+protection+policy&year=&month=-1&tagfilter=&hide_thanks_log=1 his revision deletions], the latter of which remain in effect. I think you overestimate how much latitude there is for presenting useful information on all topics. | ||
:It sounds like "wiki management" is active and on your side, although they may have taken awhile to arrive to the scene. [[User:Leucosticte|Leucosticte]] ([[User talk:Leucosticte|talk]]) 04:47, 6 January 2015 (UTC) | :It sounds like "wiki management" is active and on your side, although they may have taken awhile to arrive to the scene. [[User:Leucosticte|Leucosticte]] ([[User talk:Leucosticte|talk]]) 04:47, 6 January 2015 (UTC) | ||
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::The admin who blocked me is still a bureaucrat at Wikiversity. And almost never does anything, and he never did actually oppose my Wikiversitan agenda, he just hated the walls of text. He's a sound-bite kinda guy. My agenda there is a full realization of the goals of Wikiversity, and it has high consensus. | ::The admin who blocked me is still a bureaucrat at Wikiversity. And almost never does anything, and he never did actually oppose my Wikiversitan agenda, he just hated the walls of text. He's a sound-bite kinda guy. My agenda there is a full realization of the goals of Wikiversity, and it has high consensus. | ||
::So, here, what is the goal of the wiki? Your participation is raising that question, so my hope is that it will be resolved. It's been murky, with mixed motives. I don't think the founder has a clear idea, himself, that is why you can see conflict in what is being proposed, and what he's approved of, or has personally done, before. This is an old wiki. There is a fork in the road. --[[User:Abd|Abd]] ([[User talk:Abd|talk]]) 15:24, 6 January 2015 (UTC) | ::So, here, what is the goal of the wiki? Your participation is raising that question, so my hope is that it will be resolved. It's been murky, with mixed motives. I don't think the founder has a clear idea, himself, that is why you can see conflict in what is being proposed, and what he's approved of, or has personally done, before. This is an old wiki. There is a fork in the road. --[[User:Abd|Abd]] ([[User talk:Abd|talk]]) 15:24, 6 January 2015 (UTC) | ||
:::As far as Abd is concern, Nathan, I find him to be eminently more sensible and reasonable and more willing to comply with requests for courtesy and procedure, and while you may find these stumbling blocks, I do not. As for being on his side, I'll confess I'm more partial to granting his views consideration because he isn't as belligerent about them, but no, every word he types does not have my total blessing. As for views on prohibited content, my chief concerns are Wikiindex's reputation and legal liability, and while one could argue sites like [[Wikisource]] and [[Wikilivres]] have potentially illegal content depending on your country, they admit as much and urge the users exercise due legal caution, which is why I'd have no trouble with them being given pages or discussed. Sites that discuss the normalization of child porn and pedophilia are fine in a neutral context, but they tilt heavily in the interest of illegal acts when they start arguing for it, and since I don't believe it is ethically or legally sensible to provide links to sites that argue for the incitement of criminal acts minus any caveats about exercising legal restraint, and having seen BoyWiki and Newgon Wiki, they are only concerned with help pedophiles hide themselves from the law, which is why I would oppose them without question. Doxxing sites like [[Encyclopedia Dramatica]] are legally gray, but from what I've seen, their policy is only to allow publicly available content, and while they do provide links to private dox, they make it clear it's entirely at your own risk and to my knowledge delete it and revisions with it from pages, as well as having a zero tolerance for child porn and bestiality, which is why I would argue a site like that still deserves a page. [[User:Arcane|Arcane]] ([[User talk:Arcane|talk]]) 16:48, 6 January 2015 (UTC) | :::As far as Abd is concern, Nathan, I find him to be eminently more sensible and reasonable and more willing to comply with requests for courtesy and procedure, and while you may find these stumbling blocks, I do not. As for being on his side, I'll confess I'm more partial to granting his views consideration because he isn't as belligerent about them, but no, every word he types does not have my total blessing. As for views on prohibited content, my chief concerns are Wikiindex's reputation and legal liability, and while one could argue sites like [[:Category:Wikisource|Wikisource]] and [[Wikilivres]] have potentially illegal content depending on your country, they admit as much and urge the users exercise due legal caution, which is why I'd have no trouble with them being given pages or discussed. Sites that discuss the normalization of child porn and pedophilia are fine in a neutral context, but they tilt heavily in the interest of illegal acts when they start arguing for it, and since I don't believe it is ethically or legally sensible to provide links to sites that argue for the incitement of criminal acts minus any caveats about exercising legal restraint, and having seen BoyWiki and Newgon Wiki, they are only concerned with help pedophiles hide themselves from the law, which is why I would oppose them without question. Doxxing sites like [[Encyclopedia Dramatica]] are legally gray, but from what I've seen, their policy is only to allow publicly available content, and while they do provide links to private dox, they make it clear it's entirely at your own risk and to my knowledge delete it and revisions with it from pages, as well as having a zero tolerance for child porn and bestiality, which is why I would argue a site like that still deserves a page. [[User:Arcane|Arcane]] ([[User talk:Arcane|talk]]) 16:48, 6 January 2015 (UTC) | ||
::::I don't think that BoyWiki and Newgon Wiki "are only concerned with help pedophiles hide themselves from the law". Newgon Wiki has one page devoted to computer security tips. The other pages are about research, debate, outreach, etc. BoyWiki is largely about boylover culture and history. Also, I think you're missing the distinction between {{Wp|advocacy and incitement}}. [[User:Leucosticte|Leucosticte]] ([[User talk:Leucosticte|talk]]) 17:43, 6 January 2015 (UTC) | ::::I don't think that BoyWiki and Newgon Wiki "are only concerned with help pedophiles hide themselves from the law". Newgon Wiki has one page devoted to computer security tips. The other pages are about research, debate, outreach, etc. BoyWiki is largely about boylover culture and history. Also, I think you're missing the distinction between {{Wp|advocacy and incitement}}. [[User:Leucosticte|Leucosticte]] ([[User talk:Leucosticte|talk]]) 17:43, 6 January 2015 (UTC) | ||
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